Thursday, July 2, 2009

The things we tolerate


So after a sappy story about horse kisses I have to follow up. My boy is mouthy. In my story like so many horse stories, something is portrayed as sweet and cute. In reality, it's not.

I have met my share of mouthy horses. Most I did not care for simply because I was usually working with them. When you're holding a mouthy horse for a veterinary procedure it's annoying as hell to have them nipping/biting at you. You can't always correct them when the doc is underneath them. Well, you can but you risk the vet's noggin and it's your job to help protect that noggin and all the other vet parts at almost all costs. That's at least how seriously I took my responsibility. I did not like mouthy horses much. At all. They made my job more difficult and often owners weren't exactly willing to let me have a 'Come to Jesus' meeting with their sweet Foo-foo-McNips.

My first trainer had a young horse, much like Gator, we'll call this boy Topper. He'd steal your hat, drink out of a soda bottle and if you didn't give it to him flap his lips, pull your shirt generally act like a goof. Rarely, if ever did teeth come into play. If they did, it was usually an accidental pinch and reacting by immediately throwing his head back, expecting punishment. Same with my boy. It's viewed as endearing to those of us that know the horse well when they're nuzzling and licking you. He's showing personality and lets be honest, horses DO show affection with their mouths. I mean, c'mon, ever watched to buddies scratch withers in the field?
However, what crosses the line? I'm sure some people would find Topper and Gator's antics annoying as all get out. I draw the line when they're demanding something and/or actually put the slightest bit of teeth into it. THAT is never okay. They also need to know when we're serious about what's going on and they better be all business. Topper and Gator get that for the most part. They know there is a boundary... I think.

Last night my husband decided to come out to the barn. Gator was less than... super friendly. He's only met hubby maybe 2 or 3 times. Ears 3/4 back, not pinned but not thrilled. Husband approached from the front first trying to pet his face, after being told that's not best, he moved beside for neck pets. Gator started grabbing at him. While my husband is a big tough guy, he's not used to a 1000lb animal nipping at him. It didn't make him comfortable. It pissed me off.

I wasn't pissed at Gator, I was pissed at myself. I let him pull my zipper or grab my sleeve. I am embarrassed to admit it but I tolerate the occasional cheek lick. He was doing the same to my horse inexperienced husband but in a less pleasant way. Now, had he REALLY wanted to bite him, my husband would have a horse teeth shaped mark somewhere on his person. It happens in a flash when they mean it- most of us know that too well. I know he was testing my husband and they do that to new people/herd mates but... what if? I've never seen him be malicious in his intent with a person. His previous owners blame his sire, saying all his male get were mouthy but agree he's never been malicious.
When is what we tolerate every day in our horses thinking it's not a actually a big deal writing it off to personality a REALLY bad thing? Is a little bit okay when they understand the boundary? Do you think genetics can be entirely to blame? Am I enabling a horse shaped monster?

I hope not but I am going to be more mindful of what he gets away with.

18 comments:

  1. haha, NCC.
    First!

    It's hard to break long-standing bad habits, especially when they get rewarded.
    Mouthy starts with handling, really early on.
    A horse's mouth is adorable, as long as the respect is there.
    I'm glad your husband didn't get bitten. Hurts like hell.
    Your last sentence says it all.
    What he gets away with, is what he will do.

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  2. Damn you GL!

    Okay, second.


    Wizard is mouthy too. He will start out by nuzzling your arm and then will give a couple of licks, then he will give just a light nip, if I let him go to far. I usually avert that by telling him I know what he is going to do and telling him no. Of course, he gives me that innocent look.

    I always tell anyone who doesn't know him to watch him when they are near him.

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  3. Gator got a good smack... in fact *I* got nipped ever so slightly after he was doing that to hubby.

    It's just one of those things some owners just do not ever get HAS to have a boundary. I've seen people who always tolerate their horse turning their ass to them when they don't want to do something. 'Oh, she doesn't liiike XYZ'. Of course not! Last night I was suprised at him and embarassed. It's something I used to lecture people about.

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  4. I agree it is somewhat intimdating to be subjected to a mouthy horse with no warning-
    None of mine are, Prince likes to wiggle his lips on my arms, but that is the extent of it.
    Redi is a lip bopping fool at dinner time if you are just a few seconds slow with the bucket. Looks ridiculous, sounds worse.

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  5. I let my own horses get away with certain things, but only the things that I decide on not them.

    I wouldn't be too upset about last night. Mike is pretty unfamiliar to Gator and an inexperienced horse person. Gator, being the smart guy that he is, was testing. Once Mike lets him know what the boundary is, Gator will be fine.

    Is his name Gator because he is mouthy?

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  6. I knew a horse that could make the sound of a washing machine with his mouth.

    Another that said "Gup, gup, GUP!"
    His name was Guppy:)

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  7. I find that implementing the grouchy-voice-warning system is helpful in these situations.
    One grouchy voice warning when you dont appreciate a certain behaviour, if certain behavior persists-SECOND grouchy voice warning. Third strike is a smack.

    The dun knows this system, and he KNOWS my grouchy voice so it saves a lot of time.
    Maybe it will help gator face :)

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  8. CCC - Yup! His registered name is Renegade but the mouthiness was another MAJOR factor.

    No, I'm not so much upset about it. I know he was testing. I told hubby (tryin' not to use our names on here CCC... bad CCC :) ) that. I also was trying to get him to smack him. When getting curried, Gator will make those faces at even people he knows well. He likes his scritches. He also likes my attention and gets annoyed even if someone distracts me by talking to me. He'll paw and get more grabby - he's not allowed to do that though.

    GL - Too funny!

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  9. Nicely - He knows the growl. Turns out my VERY serious growl is the same as the trainer who beat trained him (and could be rather rough). We both say 'here'. I've only had to get that serious once. He was trying to eat/stomp Lily. Now he lets her wander around between his legs.

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  10. HA ... freudian slip:

    the trainer who *beat* trained him

    Oops. :p

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  11. There was a pony at the barn I used to board at that made burping sounds, of course his nickname was Burp.

    Guppy, how cute.

    AB:

    "Beat" trained, I was a bit worried there.


    Mine all know my "warning sound," it is more like aaaattt, done in a strong, sharp way, and when I say "stand," I mean, stop whatever you are doing, right now and don't move.

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  12. CCC - aaattt is my lesser growl. He knows that VERY well and listens. Due to mouthiness/nosiness he gets kinda often. My 'here' is very um... serious. It scared the hell out of him the one time I used it. He was seriously afraid of me- running backwards, 'oh shit' face.



    It um... might be more um... accurate to call it 'beat trained' at times from stories I hear. And what I've seen of her myself.

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  13. AB, I think it is a "choose your battles" thing .I had a mare who when you tightened the cinch would snap and bite , at her lead rope , I would let that go but if she turned to me she got a pop. Lucky (the mare I lost this spring ) had a nervous habit of licking your hand ,irritating ,eh, but not dangerous so I let it go , gotta say though when she licked the farriers neck ...oops!! aquick "here" or "that'll do " growled out usually corrects . My biggest issue is nibbling as I fing it does tend to progress to biting. The fat baby and I had a "come to Jesus meeting about that not to long ago "

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  14. Fern:

    I bet the farrier loved the neck licking. NOT.

    I personally don't mind licking. Spunky doesn't do it, but Buck and Whinnie do. It never leads to anything else and I usually play around with their tongues which they seem to like. With Wizard, you just know that after a couple of licks, the teeth will come into play, so that isn't allowed to go too far.

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  15. Just remembered a story that seems to fit here, especially with Fern's comment on picking your battles.

    About 10-11 years ago, I was working with this guys horse for him. Really just riding him for exercise. He was a big dark bay TB, no white at all. He was a Castle Magic son and had been a breeding stallion for several years before he was cut at 7 years old. He was then trained, and I use that term loosely, to be a foxhunter. This horse was strong and had a huge stride with a massive engine to back it up. I don't what I was thinking, I am 5'3" and at the time about 110 lbs. Anywho, this horse loved to lick and snuffle me. I finally learned, if I let him lick on my face and neck and do his snuffling thing he would be good for me. If I was in a hurry and didn't, his attitude was bad which made for a really bad ride.

    That is what is called "picking your battles."

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  16. CCC - Ha. Indeed! I've actually allowed some horses, who most thought I was crazy, at the vet school do things like that. One mare head pressed into you, HARD. She was getting her hocks flushed - ouch. I was the only tech who didn't get drug down the hallway, literally. Also the only tiem the vet either didn't get kicked in the head or nearly. I let her push on me... she just wanted comfort. The vet wanted me on call.

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  17. Castle was just a very large love bug on the ground. He would literally snuffle me up and down, I think he considered me one of his girls. If I didn't understand him so well, I would have felt a little violated. It made all the difference in the world letting him be what he was.

    Unfortunately, a few years later, after I wasn't riding him anymore, he had a terrible bout of colic that ended up killing him.

    That horse could literally jump the freakin moon. I have never ridden a horse that had that much power, even Buck.

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